quote:

Originally posted by RavingLunatic:
Nina Nastasia and Jim White - You Follow Me

Not one of the worst albums, but it really frustrates me. The songs are great, and if it were a solo album it would've been great. But Jim White totally ruins the album with his shitty drumming. The drums don't match the songs at all, and sometimes it seems as if he's just banging on shit at random.

mmhh this is one of my favorite! at first i wasnt sure about it but the more i listened to it the more i liked it, the drum on that album is more melodic than keepin rythm, i now find the blend perfect, maybe you need to give it some time?

...and ist GREAT drumming not shitty!! ;-)

If you're anxious, go ahead and look up the thread, Eric. I don't feel like searching for it. And I think it's obvious that stealing something from a store is fundamentally different from downloading music. It's akin to taking a shirt, making a copy of it, and then putting the shirt back. In this case, if the person who took the shirt previously had no intention of ever buying the shirt, no one is harmed, but the individual benefits from having a shirt he would've never otherwise had.

quote:

Originally posted by ajar:

quote:

Originally posted by RavingLunatic:
Nina Nastasia and Jim White - You Follow Me

Not one of the worst albums, but it really frustrates me. The songs are great, and if it were a solo album it would've been great. But Jim White totally ruins the album with his shitty drumming. The drums don't match the songs at all, and sometimes it seems as if he's just banging on shit at random.

mmhh this is one of my favorite! at first i wasnt sure about it but the more i listened to it the more i liked it, the drum on that album is more melodic than keepin rythm, i now find the blend perfect, maybe you need to give it some time?

...and ist GREAT drumming not shitty!! ;-)

I guess I'm just not into unconventional drumming. I like stuff that is really fractured, like complicated beats or cut-up stuff, but when a guy is just sort of randomly hitting a cymbal and bass drum with no apparent pattern or correlation with the rest of the music, it just doesn't work for me.

Do you like any drum solos or rolls, and have you heard the late, great Buddy Rich?

(I'm coming from the angle that most drum solos are boring.)

quote:

Originally posted by RavingLunatic:
If you're anxious, go ahead and look up the thread, Eric. I don't feel like searching for it. And I think it's obvious that stealing something from a store is fundamentally different from downloading music. It's akin to taking a shirt, making a copy of it, and then putting the shirt back. In this case, if the person who took the shirt previously had no intention of ever buying the shirt, no one is harmed, but the individual benefits from having a shirt he would've never otherwise had.

So if I have no intention of buying a car, but I steal one, it's okay?

Hey, if you put mine back after your joyride and I get it back eventually, what's the harm? Actually, I was pissed as hell when that happened to me, and the next time it happened to the same car, I had no seats left.

quote:

Originally posted by ericg75:

quote:

Originally posted by RavingLunatic:
If you're anxious, go ahead and look up the thread, Eric. I don't feel like searching for it. And I think it's obvious that stealing something from a store is fundamentally different from downloading music. It's akin to taking a shirt, making a copy of it, and then putting the shirt back. In this case, if the person who took the shirt previously had no intention of ever buying the shirt, no one is harmed, but the individual benefits from having a shirt he would've never otherwise had.

So if I have no intention of buying a car, but I steal one, it's okay?

Did you just skip the part where I said "make a copy and put the original back"?

I think he's getting to the part where what are you doing when you make the copying, before "you put it back". But, I'm staying out of this from now on. I lost one damn car about 17 years ago. I mean, I got it back, but it wasn't driveable anymore.

This is where we ran into a stalemate the last time around. The copying part is the stealing. A CD and a car are different types of goods in that when you buy a CD, the CD isn't the part that's a commodity, the music on the CD is. Is the concept of intellectual property really that tough for you to comprehend?

Hey, no matter what, I LOVE RL, even more after that photo!

quote:

Originally posted by RavingLunatic:
Correct. I've probably listened to 200 albums this year, but I don't think a single one has been on a major label.

Well I hope you are thinking hard because otherwise I am calling BS. Maybe you think you are the "unique snowflake" of the site but you are wrong on this point. It is also wrong to blatantly steal music, I appreciate you trying to diplomatically state your side but the side you have chose to defend is just too illogical.

I wish sometimes that people were willing to at least have the guts to say "I'm doing something that is wrong, but I really don't care because I want to do it." Instead we all just justify our actions to pretend that they were right.

But I'm not getting into any kindof arguement. This is something we all have to settle on on our own. I personally enjoy waiting for an album to be released and opening the wrapper and plugging it in for the first time and knowing that it's mine and it's legal no matter how you look at it.

...getting back to the topic... I legally obtained the Liars new album (paid download) and now I want my money back, because it is the equivalent of purchasing a shirt that doesn't fit... possibly anyone.

What recourse do i have?

You should have stolen a car instead.

Of the releases I've caught this year that have received some significant praise, these are the ones I've liked the least.

1. Tones of Town - Field Music - other than closing track just a collosal bore.
2. In Advance of a Broken Arm - Marnie Stern. Highly original/totally unlistenable.
3. Tears of the Valedictorian - Frog Eyes...Combine this with last year's Sunset Rubdown and I think it's safe to say I am not a Spencer Krug fan...aside from Wolf Parade, I've hated everything this guy is involved with.
4. Friend Opportunity - Deerhoof - love the band, but this one's a misfire.
5. Cryptograms - Deerhunter - Horrible instrumental tracks on opening half of album ruin the rest of it.
6. Some Loud Thunder - CYHSY - very disappointing sophomore effort...worst production job of the year from Dave Friddman.

quote:

Originally posted by kdevilh:
...getting back to the topic... I legally obtained the Liars new album (paid download) and now I want my money back, because it is the equivalent of purchasing a shirt that doesn't fit... possibly anyone.

What recourse do i have?

Next time, just steal it, copy it, and give it back. That way if you hate it, you can pretend like you had no intention of buying it in the first place.

quote:

I wish sometimes that people were willing to at least have the guts to say "I'm doing something that is wrong, but I really don't care because I want to do it." Instead we all just justify our actions to pretend that they were right

That's what annoys me the most about people who download music illegally. If someone just came out and said, "Damn, I just didn't want to drop the $15 to buy this" that would be something I understand. At least they'd be honest, right?

I have no idea how someone can justify downloading music illegally. I mean if I spend two years at my job designing a new product, and then some other guy just steals the idea, do I have the right to be pissed about it? Hell yes, I do! Maybe they're not physically taking anything from me, but they're stealing my hard work, right? Doesn't that kind of commitment mean anything to those here that download music? If you like these band's so much, the least you can do is have the respect for how hard they work and buy the album. Or at least just admit that it's not right to steal people's hard work. Then we'll be getting somewhere.

I agree to the idea of intellectual property... I'm just having a moral quandary finding anything remotely intellectual or redeeming with one of the worst releases of the year, Liars self titled.

oh well, fool me once... etc.

quote:

Originally posted by kdevilh:
...getting back to the topic... I legally obtained the Liars new album (paid download) and now I want my money back, because it is the equivalent of purchasing a shirt that doesn't fit... possibly anyone.

What recourse do i have?

I posted a link to the stream to this album in their thread before it came out. It must have been streaming since the Saturday before it came out. These streams are free and perfectly legal. If you loved the reviews to it, you could have streamed it and then you would have known not to buy it. That's just a wild idea I have.

quote:

Originally posted by Shadrach:
I wish sometimes that people were willing to at least have the guts to say "I'm doing something that is wrong, but I really don't care because I want to do it." Instead we all just justify our actions to pretend that they were right.

Well, that's essentially what I say. I rarely buy albums anymore, I realize that really sucks for the artist on that side and it's wrong of me... but, there's so many bands that I wouldn't know about if I only paid for music. Which means that when they came to my town for a concert I wouldn't care so they wouldn't be getting the money from my concert ticket or the money from the shirt I bought.

So, it may be wrong but their are advantages to downloading music.

quote:

Originally posted by kdevilh:
one of the worst releases of the year, Liars self titled.

I don't even know how you can claim it to be one of the worst of the year... I understand disliking it, but that's a ridiculous thing to say.