quote:

Originally posted by Shadrach:
I think membership limits will crack down on people trying to double vote. And it would be sad to have something like a Britney Spears fan club get ahold of a link to our board and persuade all of there members to register and vote for Britney as number one. I bet the rest of their list would be pretty lame as well.

The ironic thing about this (aside from the fact I have one post and my opinion is therefore mere inches above worthless) is that Blackout is one of the most consistent, interesting mainstream pop albums released in a while. If I was eligible to make a list, it'd be in there with Burial, Les Savy Fav, Ricardo Villalobos, Lucky Soul and others. It's been a great year for music all over the map, and that includes pop.

your opinion isn't worthless at all, it just doesn't have any influence on the album lists. in fact, i'm always glad whenever somebody champions mainstream music on these boards (so long as it's not fergie).

quote:

Originally posted by atibon:

quote:

Originally posted by Shadrach:
I think membership limits will crack down on people trying to double vote. And it would be sad to have something like a Britney Spears fan club get ahold of a link to our board and persuade all of there members to register and vote for Britney as number one. I bet the rest of their list would be pretty lame as well.

The ironic thing about this (aside from the fact I have one post and my opinion is therefore mere inches above worthless) is that Blackout is one of the most consistent, interesting mainstream pop albums released in a while. If I was eligible to make a list, it'd be in there with Burial, Les Savy Fav, Ricardo Villalobos, Lucky Soul and others. It's been a great year for music all over the map, and that includes pop.

I'm sorry if I made it sound like your opinions are worthless. I'm not saying that at all. We could actually use some extra variety in our list. Also, the board could profit from people that are willing to throw some credit and appreciation to some mainstream pop acts.

30 posts isn't a lot. And regardless of the limit, we would love for you to join us in our discussions. We actually have a conversation going in the Pop section about Britney and Black-out. Also, you should put a top 10 or top 20 list up in the section called "Starting your Year End List". It sounds like you might have some albums on their that we haven't considered.

I don't think the moderators are trying to be disrespectful to people that haven't been around for a long time. They are trying to be extra respectful to people that have devoted a lot of time and effort to the board. If we let hundreds of people come on and add to the vote it will wash out the vote of the long time members. You can imagine the disapointment of having looked forward to voting in the year end list along with forty other people you have discussed music with all year, only to have the vote get bombarded by 400 votes from people you haven't had a chance to talk to before.

quote:

Originally posted by Shadrach:
I'm sorry if I made it sound like your opinions are worthless. I'm not saying that at all. We could actually use some extra variety in our list. Also, the board could profit from people that are willing to throw some credit and appreciation to some mainstream pop acts.

I don't think the moderators are trying to be disrespectful to people that haven't been around for a long time. They are trying to be extra respectful to people that have devoted a lot of time and effort to the board. If we let hundreds of people come on and add to the vote it will wash out the vote of the long time members. You can imagine the disapointment of having looked forward to voting in the year end list along with forty other people you have discussed music with all year, only to have the vote get bombarded by 400 votes from people you haven't had a chance to talk to before.

Sorry if my comment came off as more snide than I intended. The main point of my post wasn't really to complain about eligibility for listing, but to say that Blackout was a far better, more interesting album that I'd remotely expected.

I understand the reasons for limiting entry to the list-off based on post count / join time. On the internet, there's generally three trolls to every billy-goat rather than other way around. I've lurked / browsed this forum on and off for a while so hopefully by next year I'll be posting a list...

I'm serious about wanting to see your list though, atibon.

can i posta list, i have read this every day for years and don't want to be discriminated against just because i only posted a few times

Did you read any of the last two pages?

It's really not hard at all to get 30 posts. There are two sections in General Music alone which take absolutely no time or thought to post in (Ok, maybe the game takes a little, but I'm sorry.) Plus, Shadrach and others already described in a perfectly reasonable manner why there are limits to the list s; I suggest you read those.

quote:

Originally posted by petrolfire:
can i posta list,

Sure, you have been a member longer than 3 months.

ok, i guess i am first.
i doubt anything will come out that in the remaining month plus of this year that will change this list.

1) Radiohead - In Rainbows
2) Battles - Mirrored
3) Panda Bear - Person Pitch
4) Arcade Fire - Neon Bible
5) Sunset Rubdown - Random Spirit Lover
6) Animal Collective - Strawberry Jam
7) Twilight Sad - Fourteen Autumns And Fifteen Winters
8) Liars - Liars
9) Menomena - Friend and Foe
10) The Besnard Lakes - The Besnard Lakes Are The Dark Horse
11) Caribou - Andorra
12) The National - Boxer
13) St. Vincent - Marry Me
14) The Dirty Projectors - Rise Above
15) Deerhunter - Cryptograms
16) Frog Eyes - Tears of the Valedictorian
17) Dalek - Abandoned Language
18) Black Moth Super Rainbow - Dandelion Gum
19) LCD Soundsystem - Sound of Silver
20) Bowerbids - Hymns For A Dark Horse

I need to listen to a few albums a couple times more to be able to put together a top 50 or 100.

Thoughts?

quote:

i doubt anything will come out that in the remaining month plus of this year that will change this list.

Most of the time, i always discover new interesting music almost each month, and i'll probably wait until january 15 to make my final list, to see if a new record surprises me or if my tastes change with repeated listens of my actual top 20.

looking at the upcoming releases for this year there really is only rap albums to look foward to (correct me if i am wrong). Wu-Tang, Ghostface, Lupe Fiasco, and Lil Wayne's releases all have me excited, but I would still be surprised if they cracked my top 20. it is possible a random album could come out of left field and blow me away before the year ends, but the chances of that happening are pretty slim.

How tolerant are you all to mainstream music? I predict my taste may not be appreciated.

I’d probably be able to put a list of 5 – 10 Albums, which is pretty pox on my part, since i am a musician, but which also why i feel compelled to participate. Also should we name the genre for each album? Obviously most people will know some atrists, but there is allot artists I’ve seen posted on here I’ve never even heard of, and if it’s roughly alternative or rock, I wouldn’t mind expanding my horizons.

If anyone holds your list against you in anything more than a joking manner, they're not acting very Metacritic.

quote:

Originally posted by Alchemy:
How tolerant are you all to mainstream music? I predict my taste may not be appreciated.

I’d probably be able to put a list of 5 – 10 Albums, which is pretty pox on my part, since i am a musician, but which also why i feel compelled to participate. Also should we name the genre for each album? Obviously most people will know some atrists, but there is allot artists I’ve seen posted on here I’ve never even heard of, and if it’s roughly alternative or rock, I wouldn’t mind expanding my horizons.

I could care less if something was from the mainstream. The only thing that concerns me regarding music is the quality of the music. However, this means many different things to people. Personally technical prowess is not the biggest selling point for me. Originality matters to me because I get bored hearing bands co-opt the same sound over and over again. However, I am sure there are some bands from my list that are not entirely original.

As far as discovering new music from these lists is concerned, if you have never heard of the band by all means ask about the band. This forum is for sharing great music, I would think anyone on this message board would love to talk more about their favorite albums.

quote:

Originally posted by krugulitis:

quote:

Originally posted by Alchemy:
How tolerant are you all to mainstream music? I predict my taste may not be appreciated.

I’d probably be able to put a list of 5 – 10 Albums, which is pretty pox on my part, since i am a musician, but which also why i feel compelled to participate. Also should we name the genre for each album? Obviously most people will know some atrists, but there is allot artists I’ve seen posted on here I’ve never even heard of, and if it’s roughly alternative or rock, I wouldn’t mind expanding my horizons.

I could care less if something was from the mainstream. The only thing that concerns me regarding music is the quality of the music. However, this means many different things to people. Personally technical prowess is not the biggest selling point for me. Originality matters to me because I get bored hearing bands co-opt the same sound over and over again. However, I am sure there are some bands from my list that are not entirely original.

As far as discovering new music from these lists is concerned, if you have never heard of the band by all means ask about the band. This forum is for sharing great music, I would think anyone on this message board would love to talk more about their favorite albums.

I don't trust anyone whose list looks like a Pitchfork Top 20 and who never likes anything mainstream or anything that is not on the "cool" lists. Yes, mainstream music TENDS to be inferior because it resorts to cliches and panders to popular tastes, but this is not always the case, and an album can work beautifully within existing sounds and styles and be very very good, even if it is not revolutionary.

quote:

Originally posted by DrAwesome:

quote:

Originally posted by thefanste:
And let me just throw this out there: Okkervil River = The Dark Horse!!!

I dunno I would say: Bowerbirds = Hymns for a Dark Horse

You're both wrong. It's the Besnard Lakes. The Besnard Lakes are the Dark Horse.

It's Christmas, and the season of tradition, so I will repeat my usual tradition of objecting to the scoring system that is proposed for the top 20 list. I always get out-voted and overridden on this, but I enjoy venting.

I object to a system that allots a predetermined number of points to my votes. In all likelihood, the points allotted will not reflect what I feel.

The proposal here is to allot 40 points to #1, 35 to #2, 33 to #3, all the way down to 1 point for #20. This assumes, therefore, that I regard my #1 choice as being significantly better than my #2 choice and waaaaaaaaay better than my #10 choice or my #20 choice. And this is almost always untrue.

In fact, in most years, there are a bunch of albums that I love, and it may torture me to try to decide which is #1, #2, #3 etc. My #1 choice may, in my view, be only fractionally better than my #2 choice, or my #10 choice. Or, in other years, there may be one album that I regard as a masterpiece that is head and shoulders above the rest, so that to give it 40 points over the #2 choice's 35 is inaccurate.

In my view, the only sensible way to score in a poll like this is the way they do it in the Pazz & Jop poll. People choose their top 10 albums, and they have 100 points to allot to them, and can basically divide them up as they wish (giving no more than 25 to any album). That way, if I think that one album was head and shoulders above any other album, I can give it 25 points and give the others on my list much less. Or if I think there were three excellent and equally meritorious albums that year, I can give them all the same score. This is the only system that actually reflects the true perspective of the people who make up their personal lists.

Then, in compiling all the lists, you can calculate (a) how many total points each album got from all the people who voted and (b) how many people voted for that album anywhere on their list. You then get two perspectives -- the most admired album by points, and the most admired album by votes -- which is always very interesting to see.

Having got that off my chest, you can now all ignore me, in the usual Christmas tradition.

quote:

Originally posted by Peewee:

In my view, the only sensible way to score in a poll like this is the way they do it in the Pazz & Jop poll.

Yes, yes. We've talked about it. It's a pain in the ass to compile though, for as many lists as we get. It's a lot easier to compile lists with a set scoring system, and for the average poster, they like the albums at the top of their list better than those at at the bottom. No matter what system we pick, someone will always complain about it, but this one seems to get the fewest complaints. It's easy on the people making the lists as well as the person compiling the lists.

I understand -- I am glad I don't have to do the compiling.

But I would, personally, simply opt for a system that gives 20 points to #1, 19 to #2, etc. The proposed division of points frankly strikes me as quite bizarre.

But who cares?! None of this will stop me from posting my list, which I love to do.

This is one of those years when there was no single great album that stood out above all others, so my top 5 choices are really, in my estimation, all the same. So giving my top choice 40 points over my next choice is inaccurate. Last year, I alone in the solar system felt that Scritti Politti's "White Bread Black Bear" was far and away that best album of the year, which justified it getting significantly more points than my #2 choice.

I agree with a lot of what you are saying Peewee, this year there will be a lot of great albums contending for my top five, top ten and even my top 20. Whatever ends up in the 21-30 range is still going to be very, very good. And right now, I have about 14 albums that I all want to be in my top 10. So I see what you mean about some albums being separated by the thinnest of margins but like Eric said, it’s a pain in the butt to compile. Maybe some day…plus the “FKA-EG75 scoring method” just sounds pretty sweet don’t it?