I used to listen to tons of metal when I was growing up, but I've been pretty out of touch with the scene over the past few years. I'm not talking about the artsy metal that gets reviewed in Pitchfork - I'm already familiar enough with that - and I'm not talking about the balkanized subgenres of death and black metal. I'm talking about whatever is actually popular these days. This seems to me to be mainly metalcore and nu metal, and I figure at least some of these bands have to be a little good, no matter how much I hate Disturbed or "Linkin Park" (Jesus Christ). There's usually some genius in every genre, I think.

The one recent metal album that I've picked up lately was Trivium's The Crusade, based on a great review from Wilson & Alroy. And I do like it a lot, but it basically sounds just like 80s Metallica doing 3 minute songs, so I'm not sure if it reflects what anyone else is doing.

Anyone have any suggestions for me? Just looking for good metal that's accessible and modern without being excessively classicist - I mean, I like Iron Maiden, I'd just rather listen to the real thing than a retread.

quote:

Originally posted by odysseyandoracle:
at least some of these bands have to be a little good

No. Really, (as cliche as this may sound at this forum) the only metal that I can get into anymore is the artsy shit, because the mainstream has nothing legit to offer me. I'm not saying that all of the acts are bad per se, I'm simply saying, as you stated, that a very large majority seems to be retreading older sounds.

The only 'mainstream metal' band that I have any interest in is Tool, and they disappointed me with their last album.

If you get the chance, check out a band called Black Mountain, apparently they released a self-titled album in 05 that wasn't recieved very well because it sounds like retreaded territory, I don't have that album, but their new one In the Future is actually really good (probably a lot more Psychedelic than Metal). I've seen comparisons to Zeppelin and Black Sabbath, so at least they have good tastes.

Good luck on your mainstream quest...

http://www.myspace.com/blackmountain

quote:

Originally posted by Kool Mike:
http://www.myspace.com/blackmountain

Thanks for the recommendation, but these guys are neither modern nor really all that metal. Not a bad record but not what I was looking for; I'm not a big fan of stoner rock.

All these nu metal and metalcore bands are so popular that at least someone talented has to have followed in their footsteps. Maybe they just haven't hit it big yet. Early grunge was pretty awful too, but it did eventually spawn Nirvana.

Meh, we're on different wavelengths, bro. I hate how sub-subgenre specific everything in the supergenre of rock has become and find that I have better things to do with my time than argue with someone about whether an artist is metal with electronic influences or fucking electronicore (No offense is meant, of course).

I generally keep very few genres of rock because it's probably the most efficient way to go, as opposed to letting metal hipsters and individual bands invent their own subgenres.

Regarding 'Nu metal' and metalcore, I haven't found anything of interest in either. I think the closest thing to 'Nu metal' I enjoy would be Cypress Hill, and only marginally.


Peace.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: St. Mike,

Deftones.

Voila.

quote:

Originally posted by Kool Mike:
electronicore

Dork want.

That said, "fucking electronicore" sounds even better.

quote:

Originally posted by Kool Mike:
Meh, we're on different wavelengths, bro. I hate how sub-subgenre specific everything in the supergenre of rock has become and find that I have better things to do with my time than argue with someone about whether is metal with electronic influences or fucking electronicore (No offense is meant, of course).

I generally keep very few genres of rock because it's probably the most efficient way to go, as opposed to letting metal hipsters and individual bands invent their own subgenres.

Regarding 'Nu metal' and metalcore, I haven't found anything of interest in either. I think the closest thing to 'Nu metal' I enjoy would be Cypress Hill, and only marginally.


Peace.

Well, I'd agree with you to a large extent. Sometimes these genre distinctions are petty. But a lot of the time they're pretty useful.

Let's say you have two people who discover, say, In Flames, and then go on to ask others for recommendations. One of them asks for more good death metal bands they could listen to. Someone responds with Cannibal Corpse, Deicide, Obituary, etc. Chances are our guy here is going to be really disappointed when he goes to listen to those bands.

Guy #2 says, what are some good melodic death metal bands? One more word, a completely different list. And this list would include many bands a fan of In Flames is likely to enjoy more than Deicide.

That's a pretty convoluted example, but I hope you see what I mean. Genre distinctions can be extremely important when looking for new music - especially when it's a type of music that's pretty much ignored by mass media critics, like metal. A search for Swedish melodic death metal is going to give you a much easier list of bands to navigate than a search for just metal or heavy rock. Putting Budgie and Pig Destroyer into the same genre is just counterproductive - there is no reason at all to think that because a person likes one they would like the other.

I'm not criticizing you for giving the recommendation, just saying that it wasn't what I was looking for in my post, and that itself really proves the usefulness of genre distinctions when they are actually meaningful. I don't think anyone likes giving a specific band their own genre of music just because they use a 5 string bass or something.

I listen to more different styles of music than most people. I'm not someone who discriminates just on that. But sometimes finding gems hidden within the mainstream can actually be harder than finding a more obscure band.

To sum up: genre distinctions are important when they mean something significant. Just calling everything in the style of metal "metal" doesn't help anybody do anything constructive. It tells you very little about what the music actually is. This is why historians of classical music have cut it up into so many different genres. It's useful for discussion and recommendation.

quote:

Originally posted by Dork:
Deftones.

Voila.

I'm embarrassed to say that I didn't even realize they were still around. I'll have to check out what they've done recently.

No, you're cool bro, I've seen a lot of nice names in metal mentioned by you. I will say, however, that the title of your most recent blog post is rather depressing in relation to some of the awesome bands mentioned previously.

I'm absolutely positive that rock music could be safely put into less than ten genres, however. A search for Swedish melodic death metal shouldn't be all that different than just plain death metal (a lot of subgenres sound different depending on the location of the artist).

Genre specifications generally make it harder for others to get into music than it really should be. For instance, I listen to a lot of electronic music (another supergenre that has WAY too many subgenres) and generally when I have conversations with others about the music, there is the inevitable and immediate debate about whether Juno Reactor is psy-trance or Goa-trance (just an example).

It just doesn't seem efficient when the main goal is the enjoy the wonderful experience that is music. Especially with music omnivores like ourselves. Cheers.

quote:

Originally posted by Dork:

quote:

Originally posted by Kool Mike:
electronicore

Dork want.

That said, "fucking electronicore" sounds even better.

Actually, you probably don't. Of the two examples I know, one is the equivalent of "Christian Death Metal" (Speaking of genres that shouldn't exist) and the other was a Hot Topic featured artist.

quote:

Originally posted by Kool Mike:
No, you're cool bro, I've seen a lot of nice names in metal mentioned by you. I will say, however, that the title of your most recent blog post is rather depressing in relation to some of the awesome bands mentioned previously.

LOL. Yes, I know, there's no accounting for taste. I'm sort of an inclusionist when I listen to music - I try to get myself in the frame of mind of someone who would really love it. I try to figure out what makes a certain style of music good. My philosophy is that it's always better to "get" something than it is to not get it...so I give everything a try. There must be a reason something is so popular, no?

Of course, I don't find myself reading Dan Brown novels or watching Dancing With the Stars, so maybe I just have some sort of perverse fascination with bad music.

quote:

Genre specifications generally make it harder for others to get into music than it really should be. For instance, I listen to a lot of electronic music (another supergenre that has WAY too many subgenres) and generally when I have conversations with others about the music, there is the inevitable and immediate debate about whether Juno Reactor is psy-trance or Goa-trance (just an example).

It just doesn't seem efficient when the main goal is the enjoy the wonderful experience that is music. Especially with music omnivores like ourselves. Cheers.

I definitely agree with you there. Arguing about what sort of subgenre a band should belong to is pretty dumb, and you won't find me doing it very often - if it isn't immediately obvious then it probably isn't a useful distinction. I for one have always found the difference between psy-trance and Goa-trance to be impossibly arcane.

quote:

Originally posted by odysseyandoracle:
I'm embarrassed to say that I didn't even realize they were still around. I'll have to check out what they've done recently.

They've never touched the absolute wonder of White Pony, (for me, the unmatched pinnacle of "nu-metal") but I still enjoy the stuff they're releasing to an extent.

quote:

Originally posted by odysseyandoracle:
ggestions for me? Just looking for good metal that's accessible and modern without being excessively classicist - I mean, I like Iron Maiden, I'd just rather listen to the real thing than a retread.

This is a tough task. Death metal and black metal were better in the early nineties than now. There's not much territory that bands like the ones you mentioned already (FYI, I'd also add Carcass, Dismember, Atheist, Cathedral, Neurosis, Summoning, and Burzum) haven't covered years ago. One of the few modern metal bands that are worth getting into are Mastodon, but I assume you have heard them already. Some bands appear to be retreads, but they do it damn well, like 3 Inches of Blood. And, FWIW, I know some people lump Dillinger Escape Plan into the dreaded metalcore genre, but at least, they're doing interesting stuff with their sound.

I've heard the band Converge thrown around a lot when talking about "good" metalcore. I've yet to check them out though because i'm sort of scared off by that term. Can anybody here vouch for them?

I'll sort of tepidly recommend the last Between the Buried and Me album. I wouldn't call accesible or anything, but I think it falls in to the metalcore category. It takes a while to unpack but it's decent.

What I've heard from Converge isn't too bad. It's pretty technical - not nearly at the DEP level but a good deal more complex than, say, Killswitch Engage, who seem to be pretty popular right now. I gave them a listen recently and I was extremely unimpressed. I like my metal bands to play something resembling discernible riffs, regardless of what subgenre they're in. Not to mention their abominable cover of "Holy Diver."

On the other hand, I did pick up Lamb of God's most recent album and I like it. They certainly owe a lot to Pantera, but what American metal band these days doesn't? They could use a better singer, though.

quote:

I've heard the band Converge thrown around a lot when talking about "good" metalcore. I've yet to check them out though because i'm sort of scared off by that term

I would never lump Converge in with the current wave of metalcore bands. I personally find all of that stuff to be some of the most generic garbage to come down the pipeline in a long time. Unfortunately most of those bands would probably cite Converge as an influence but if you did a side by side comparison you might not ever see it. The term metalcore used in relation to Converge would be more accurate in it's incarnation as a description of a band that owes some debt to both metal and hardcore. Unlike the current wave of "metalcore" bands, Converge's metal influences are more along the lines of something like Slayer but also stoner stuff like Sleep while their hardcore influences are bands like Black Flag, Discharge or early Neurosis. I have a feeling that even if these younger "metalcore" acts have listened to that specific hardcore stuff that they certainly didn't incorporate anything from it into their own sound. Early Converge albums like When Forever Comes Crashing and Petitioning the Empty Sky certainly owe a lot to Slayer or even to Today is the Day, whose own Steve Austin produced Forever. When they get to Jane Doe it becomes this perfect amalgamation of so many different styles of metal including grindcore, stoner, and doom that don't seem like they would gel on the surface but definitely do. You can also see the influence of bands like Swans and Sonic Youth to some extent in their work, at least texturally. They definitely don't deserve to be written off like the plethora of shitty bands that deserve to be lumped under a generic umbrella term like "metalcore" do. That's just my opinion though.

Thanks for the in depth description Jonathan. They sound like something I could dig, so i'll probably pick up Jane Doe next time i'm at the music store.

Um, a band that someone here at metacritic recommended I think fits into the more classic heavy metal category. They're called The Sword, the album is "Age of Winters". Straightforward, heavy guitar, with actual singing, not screaming. Not that I have any problem with screaming.

Also, i've been digging this album by a band The Pax Cecilia. They send the cd to you free if you request it on their web site.

Thrice is a band that I dig as well. Also, Dork mentioned the Deftones. They kick massive ass. Both pretty straight forward metal bands.

quote:

Originally posted by hudson:
Also, i've been digging this album by a band The Pax Cecilia. They send the cd to you free if you request it on their web site.

Thanks for the suggestion, bro. Free, legal, music is always nice.