quote:

Originally posted by BContrat:
I'm not just saying this to be cute and all INDIE but I actually like the lo-fi sound on Bee Thousand. The choppy editing is sort of endearing and integral to the whole feel of the album.

Absolutely. I mean Pollard (and Sprout's) two-minute pop gems don't lend themselves to heavy-handed production. Witness the awful production by Ric Ocasek on Do the Collapse. I have pretty much all the demos for that album, and I can tell you that album was ruined.

quote:

Woke on a Whaleheart by Bill Callahan
Some nice songs, but completely unlistenable thanks to terrible over-production. I haven't made it all the way through the album yet, it's THAT plodding.

Yeah, it's not a bad album, but I know what you mean - there's way too many overdubs. It particularly sticks out for me because his previous album, A River Aint Too Much To Love was so well produced, I think - very bare and spacious.

I find the Arcade Fire arguments amusing. I'm probably one of the few (the proud) who prefers the whole of Neon Bible - the sound, the songs, the playing - over Funeral (and yes, I bought Funeral BEFORE NB).

The Replacements' "Tim" is a great example. Such a great album....with that trebbly 80's production. Yes, I know "trebbly" is not a word. Or is it....

Calling Nirvana a Pixies rip-off band is so incredibly lame I don't even know how to start describing how lame it is in a way to make you realize how lame it is and I realize run on sentences are lame and that I am using the word "lame" repeatedly. Frank Black, who could easily of taken credit, has even stated he sees no similarities. This could be cause he is not a fan, but that is not the point. It's easy to say that because Nirvana was highly influenced by the Pixies and Kurt Cobain claimed Nirvana as a "Pixies rip-off band". So he has a self-deprecating sense of humor....get over it. So do I. "Nevermind" has far more in common with the John Lennon than any other band in history by far, and "In Utero" is one of the greatest countercultural punk statements I've ever heard. I realize it is no longer "cool" to like Nirvana, but I was never about being cool....and that's what makes me so damn cool. Oh shit....is that me trying to be cool?

quote:

Originally posted by smileyface:
It's easy to say that because Nirvana was highly influenced by the Pixies and Kurt Cobain claimed Nirvana as a "Pixies rip-off band".

Although I'm a little tired of everyone reminding me how great Nirvana was (not aimed at you, I'm looking at the corporate media), I do still love all three of their proper albums and their Unplugged album and first odds and sods compilation are also essential. My personal favorite Kurt Cobain description of Nirvana is when he said, "By definition pop is extremely catchy, whether you like it or not. There are some pop songs I hate but I can't get them out out of my head. Our songs also have the standard pop format: Verse, chorus, verse, chorus, solo, bad solo. All in all, I think we sound like the Knack and the Bay City Rollers being molested by Black Flag and Black Sabbath."

quote:

Originally posted by Maximum Jack:
Although I'm a little tired of everyone reminding me how great Nirvana was (not aimed at you, I'm looking at the corporate media), I do still love all three of their proper albums and their Unplugged album and first odds and sods compilation are also essential.

Yeah I agree completely. That is precisely the problem. The corporate media over-exaggerates someone, so the indie underworld has to counter-act this over-indulgence by whining about how "over-rated" and trivial they were. I just get sick of defending Nirvana, and many other bands that fall into the same category, to complete idiocy.

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Originally posted by RavingLunatic:
--Iron and Wine's "The Creek and the Cradle"

I thought this made it even better. I loved hearing Sam's breathing. I felt that it added to the rustic feeling of the songs.

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Yeah I agree completely. That is precisely the problem. The corporate media over-exaggerates someone, so the indie underworld has to counter-act this over-indulgence by whining about how "over-rated" and trivial they were. I just get sick of defending Nirvana, and many other bands that fall into the same category, to complete idiocy.

I completely agree with this, however, for me my hatred of Nirvana purely stands on how many times I've heard them on the radio. I try to avoid local radio stations if I can, but when they happen to be on at work or something, it's Nirvana, old PJ, Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd, etc... Great bands, all, but the fact remains they are NOT the only great bands from their respective eras, and that bothers me that radio can play five different songs from these bands, and NONE from other, perhaps less popular bands. 'Tis a shame, because it's not the bands' fault: it's Clear Channel's
I hope that rant made sense. I'm running on low sleep...

quote:

Originally posted by Tweedy's party time lounge:
One 2007 record that comes to mind when i think about bad production is Liars - s/t. I also think about Arcade Fire - Neon Bible. The arcade fire record sounds like they have recorded at the back of an underground cathedral stage.

Don't forget Some Loud Thunder and A Place To Bury Strangers (I still love A Place To Bury Strangers though ).

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Originally posted by BAfé:

quote:

Originally posted by Tweedy's party time lounge:
One 2007 record that comes to mind when i think about bad production is Liars - s/t. I also think about Arcade Fire - Neon Bible. The arcade fire record sounds like they have recorded at the back of an underground cathedral stage.

Don't forget Some Loud Thunder and A Place To Bury Strangers (I still love A Place To Bury Strangers though ).

Good calls...
The bombastic production helped ruin Some Loud Thunder for me - along with weaker songs. Ounsworth's voice didn't bother me in the debut, but it grates my ears badly this time. The production has something to do with this reaction, I think. Or maybe I ran out of patience the 2nd time for what is essentially bad singing. I would have liked Neon Bible better without the cavernous production. I, too, still like A Place to Bury Strangers, but I do so what to turn it down. Liars, well, I still like that one, too, on the strength of the musical ideas, mood/atmosphere, beats and -- Gasp! Is this Liars? -- whiffs of melody. But it would be so much better with more professional production.

Return to Cookie Mountain was a consistent album all the way through but that was the production that killed the album for me. I'd say there's too little energy there. Some songs doesn't work well because of their awkward laziness.

cookie mountain had great production imo.. the promo leak was a bit sludgy, though. make sure that's not the one you're listening to!
I agree Neon Bible's production is no good. it's over-bombastic and smushes all the instruments into an indiscernible sheet under Win's voice. Also, I think it would be best if we didn't blame reactions and counterreactions and 'the indie underworld/mainstream whatever' any time someone has an opinion about neon bible.. it may be slightly true, but talking about it all the time just makes it even more time. let's just leave it at some people like it, some people don't...

I know there's a bunch of other albums that I have strong opinions about the production of, but I can't think of any right now.. interesting topic for sure

quote:

Originally posted by Maximum Jack Frost:

quote:

Originally posted by smileyface:
It's easy to say that because Nirvana was highly influenced by the Pixies and Kurt Cobain claimed Nirvana as a "Pixies rip-off band".

Although I'm a little tired of everyone reminding me how great Nirvana was (not aimed at you, I'm looking at the corporate media), I do still love all three of their proper albums and their Unplugged album and first odds and sods compilation are also essential. My personal favorite Kurt Cobain description of Nirvana is when he said, "By definition pop is extremely catchy, whether you like it or not. There are some pop songs I hate but I can't get them out out of my head. Our songs also have the standard pop format: Verse, chorus, verse, chorus, solo, bad solo. All in all, I think we sound like the Knack and the Bay City Rollers being molested by Black Flag and Black Sabbath."

Nice, another famous Cobain quote was "we sound just like Cheap Trick, but with more guitar distortion".

Early on in this thread someone mentions Trick's In Color. I second that, the balls were cut off some great songs (much to the band's chagrin). In contrast, their first album (which is one of my all-time faves and arguably one of the best debuts ever) is so raw and full of energy it's still relevant today.

Steve Albini did have CT re-record In Color in the late 90's but it was never released. Although I'm sure there are copies floating around out there.

The Last Nick Cave album.

quote:

Originally posted by big willy:
Early on in this thread someone mentions Trick's In Color. I second that, the balls were cut off some great songs (much to the band's chagrin). In contrast, their first album (which is one of my all-time faves and arguably one of the best debuts ever) is so raw and full of energy it's still relevant today.

I <3 In Color

If you've got a problem with the glossiness of Cheap Trick's In Color, the perfect antidote is their Live At Budokan album which features the best songs from In Color. It's one of the few live records where most of the songs beat the studio versions.