I am not sure exactly where to post this so moderators can feel free to relocate it.

I just wanted to start a topic on the increasingly more noticable/available genre of noise. I don't, exactly what all the hip genre names are but they range from the more ambient home listening type stuff to the more abrasive, uh...er, noise. Boomkat stuff. Soundscapes. Noise.

I was interested in what some of your general impressions were. If you have noticed. If you think it is a faddish hipster pretension. If you are interested in the more beautiful or more harsh or both or neither. Playthroughs or Burned Mind. If it is relevant or worthless. Do you have favourites or most hated creators/composers/artists/decomposers/destructors.

I have personally found quite a bit legitimate interest in and was wondering if jonathanbrisby and I were the only ones. your subjectiveness please...

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Sicnarf,

I love Fennesz, Sonic Youth, Tim Heckler, Jim O'Rourke and Keith Fullerton Whitman, so I guess I like 'noise' as a genre. I'm sure there are more abstract 'noise' records that I wouldn't enjoy, though; I like a little melody with my noise.

Does the Acid Mothers Temple fit in this category? I enjoy them, especially late at night, and they certainly are prolific. I think the No-Neck Blues Band might be a worthy mention here as well as the Sunburned Hand of Man. When the artists incorporate a good variety of styles is what I prefer- soundscapes and noise seem to describe No-Neck and Sunburned, an erratic music force that grabs one's attention. Comets On Fire, certainly some fun noise there.

I'm familiar with some of the major bands in the scene like Merzbow and The Boredoms. I guess stuff like Melt Banana and The Locust and groups like that also fit in here. Not something I enjoy on a regular basis, but every now and then it fulfills a craving! I went to school with a guy who was in a very cool noise band, I used to enjoy going to his shows quite a lot!

Oh hell yeah! A topic dear to my heart. It seems that after several other posts it has become apparent that everyone's blanket definition of "noise" as a genre is different. Many of the groups listed in the above posts are both sporadic and similar at the same time. Maybe avant-garde would be a better choice. Artists like Fennesz, Tim Hecker, Jim O'Rourke, Keith Fullerton Whitman, and Oren Ambarchi are often referred to as electro-acoustic due to the fact that they play actual instruments and then manipulate them using computers. Groups like No-Neck Blues Band, Sunburned Hand of the Man, Wooden Wand & The Vanishing Voice, Six Organs of Admittance, and Jackie-O Motherfucker are psych-folk. Melt-Banana and The Locust are just grindcore bands that are a little more inventive than most. The Boredoms are well......they're The Boredoms and they fucking rule. I could easily see how any of these groups could fit into the general noise catagory. That's the great thing about the genre, it's entirely subjective. Where one person hears melody, another might not. Personally when I think of straight up noise I think of artists like Wolf Eyes, Hair Police, Yellow Swans (D. Yellow Swans), and certainly Merzbow. There is also drone, artists like Double Leopards, Birchville Cat Motel, GHQ, Alistair Galbraith, Vibracathedral Orchestra and others. Some of the aforementioned psych-folk artists can sometimes cross the line into drone especially Wooden Wand and Jackie-O. Overall I think this is a great thread and welcome even more input.

Sorry to post twice, but I definitely think that noise is a legitimate artform. There have been avant-garde/experimental artists as far back as there has been recorded music. There is a really great compilation series on the Sub Rosa label called An Anthology of Noise and Electronic Recordings. There are four volumes of this thing, some of the recordings dating back to the 1930's even. You'd be very surprised at what was capable of being produced in the interest of science and recording technology and how much of it is similar to some of the artists I mentioned in the other post.

Nice thread. There's some sewer construction going on in my neighbor, with lots of jackhammers. Does that count?

I'm going to switch this to 'indie' because I'm (pretty) sure there aren't any noise artists in pop, country, etc.

quote:

If you think it is a faddish hipster pretension.

That's pretty much what I think. If I want noise I'll just turn my radio to a station broadcasting static. I honestly think this is a fad and that no virtually one will be listening to the noise artists of today 10 years down the line.

I have a tougher time with some of the more grating stuff. While I am a texture fiend and will glory in an interesting "sound" for days on end there is something to be said about variety. An aquired ear may be able to distinguish between different statics but I think there is a potential here that is untapped. I have found quite a bit more rewards with the more subtle, ambient drones than the abrasive ones. Eluvium's Talk Amongst The Trees released last year is already one of my favourite albums of all time. Stars of the Lid have also been on constant rotation. I've been quite impressed some artists in the more varied middle ground. Animal Collective has made some incredible tracks in this vein along with some of the others in the psych folk vein. The largest hipster vibe I get is from the Wolf Eyes crowd. Seems like New York is going nuts over these guys and all their similar groups that release limited vinyl/cassettes/cd-rs. Too many of these groups are thriving abrasive noise but really make you question if there is anything inventive I've yet to find anything really substantial here and would appreciate recommendations.

i can't stand abrasive noise, i much prefer the hushed and relaxed tones of ambient/electro-acoustic compositions...but...i'm really liking black dice recently, i think that could be fairly labeled as noise. i like how lots of their songs have great percussion that get your head nodding while the crazy guitar(?) noises surround your aural headspace, kind like some sugar to help the medicine go down. i particularly like the Cone Toaster 7" ep single thing they released, but their latest, Broken Ear Record, is also very good, very listenable.

I've been really liking Black Dice lately too but I only have Creature Comfort. How is the new record. Beaches and Canyons is supposed to awesome too but I never get around to getting it.

I'm not entirely sure what to think. I like to be open to experimentation, but I also like to see the risk/reward in pushing the limits. I've been to a few shows where the artists would be considered noise. I thought Sunburned Hand of the Man were just pushing the limits of what an audience can take. I felt there was a bad vibe in the crowd (a la "these guys suck"), and the band seemed to feed off it. At Four-Tet shows, he starts creating beats and layering them with samples and created noise...slowly, he'll start speeding it up and fucking with it until there is no discernable beat or individual sounds, just one big peice of noise. I never enjoy that part of the show. I thought Gang-Gang Dance were maybe a noise band, but their show was great, maybe because there were melodies and rythyms beneath all the noise.

I think I'm a fan of "noise-lite"...hey a new genre! I love Broadcast, Animal Collective, Gang-Gang, Four-Tet. I like the organization of noise, and not when it seems noise for noise's sake. I love the new Broken Social Scene. Dave Newfeld (producer) piles on layer after layer of instruments (on one song, there's over 100 tracks). I know that's not 'noise' but it is chaotic and disorganized until he peels away the tracks and reveals a basic but quite pretty melody. I like when there is some sort of structure. Does this classify as noise? I don't know.

Sorry if I wasted yer time with my nonsense. Cheers.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Il Mago,

i haven't heard creature comfort. it seems like we've not heard the same records, i think between the two of us we have a single black dice fan...but you should check out the new one, i found it easy to listen to without being boring. i just soulseeked beaches and canyons yesterday, i'm looking forward to checking that out.

I'm a huge Black Dice fan. The past three albums have all been very good. Beaches & Canyons is the obvious choice out of the three, but Creature Comforts is also nice and more digestable considering that it's eight shorter tracks instead of five really long ones.

I can definitely see how some of you might want to backlash against Wolf Eyes and that crowd just because it's popular. Personally I find some of the groups mentioned above in others' posts like Broken Social Scene to be terribly boring products of hype. As for Wolf Eyes, I saw them last year with Prurient in Atlanta and it was one of the best shows I've ever seen. I'm all about the limited run CD-R stuff and I really like super abrasive noise. In response to RavingLunatic saying that noone will care about these artists in ten years, I'm sure that the same was said about Throbbing Gristle, CAN, Amon Duul II, Faust, and others exploring the outskirts of audial capacity in the late 60's to late 70's. I'm not saying that any of these groups will definitely make a lasting impression or anything, but there have certainly been some very notable releases in the genre in this decade alone. I'm referring to albums like Black Dice's Beaches & Canyons, Fennesz' Endless Summer, Keith Fullerton Whitman's Playthroughs, and even Wolf Eyes' Burned Mind. As I stated above, the idea of noise as art/music is not some new or novel idea. Halim el-Dabh's "Wire Recorder Piece" from 1944 is a prime example. The genre of "indie rock" or even rock music itself is relatively new as opposed to the science of sound exploration which has been around ever since audio recordings were made possible. To be totally honest, if it weren't for those pioneers in the engineering field experimenting with the recording process and technology, most of the recorded music that you know of wouldn't exist in it's present form. If you want to argue that those older groups I mentioned played "actual songs" while making noise, the only retort I can offer is that the same individuals who don't like, understand, or appreciate noise for what it is now would have been the same types in the 70's calling those groups unlistenable. There are always gonna be naysayers. I'm not going to let anyone detract me from enjoying the music I like. If you'd rather listen to some indie-pop then good for you, more power to you. Personally I find some of that stuff just as offensive to my ears as noise is to some other people. While some people don't want to hear a load of trashy old noise, I might not want to hear stuff like Broken Social Scene, Feist, Destroyer, or the Decemberists as I find them all boring products of hype.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: jonathanbrisby,

Hey JBrisby,

It sounds like you've got your back against a wall or something. You don't have to get so defensive. Personally, I really haven't delved too far into the noise genre, it's relatively new to me. Obviously I'm interested in finding out more, which I thought was the idea for this thread. If you want to win people to your way of thinking, you may like to bridge a gap or something. Like "Hey, if you like Broadcast, then you may want to listen to such and such...that's a good starting point". Just an example. I didn't come in here to say my music is better than yours. It's a discussion. Basically I was saying I like structure. I find some 'noise' I listen to sounds as if the artists are going in blind and hoping something new/interesting comes out of it (a la jamming), instead of having a game plan.

Obviously there's not a big platform (relatively speaking) for noise artists, you should be promoting them any chance you get. If the scene grows, these artists will make more money and will continue to do what they love. Everyone benefits. You're like one of these people who argue "you either understand or you don't, and if you don't understand, I couldn't possibly explain it to you". Anyway, like I said, if you think you can open my eyes to something new/interesting, then please do. That's why I come to metacritic in the first place.

Thanks,

I certainly didn't feel like I had my back against the wall. I like Broadcast too man. In fact my comment was directed at RavingLunatic's comment and I specifically addressed that. I was just making some points in a discussion. I thought we were here to discuss the genre itself. If you want recommendations, I would take any of the albums I mentioned in the above post as just that, but I don't necessarily think I'd use Broadcast as a jumping off point to check out something harsh though. If you like discernable melody and song structure then this probably isn't the place for that. Most of the artists discussed here aren't likely to adhere to that formula. In fact, I'm a little unsure why you'd want to get into noise if you begin by stating that you like structure and melody, two facets of music that can generally be thrown to the wind in this genre. I'm not trying to assert that I know anyone's else's position except for my own. In light of that, I just wanted to maybe explain myself. I didn't mean to turn you away or make you feel inferior. I was just trying to take a proactive stance on something I feel strongly about. I didn't mean to try and say that you don't understand or that you can't understand. I was trying to help those understand that maybe don't.

I respect effort and I respect achievement. I want to listen to something that is well thought out and well executed. It's not like I only watch comedies or something, and it's the same for music. I come to Metacritic to find things I might otherwise not have checked out. It's worked so far, I've discovered a lot of exciting music by coming here. I'm always up for something new, trying to keep myself interested, keep the rust off, etc.

I suppose my ultimate point was that I don't particularly enjoy jamming or noodling, throwing shit at the wall to see what sticks. My idea of structure isn't necessarily melody or rythym; more a game plan or rules or something like that.

Let's not fight anymore, okay? You're still coming for dinner tonight, right? Stephanie says Hi.

quote:

Groups like No-Neck Blues Band, Sunburned Hand of the Man, Wooden Wand & The Vanishing Voice, Six Organs of Admittance, and Jackie-O Motherfucker are psych-folk. The Boredoms are well......they're The Boredoms and they fucking rule.

Hey JB,
I was just wondering how familiar you were with No-Neck, Sunburned Hand, Wooden Wand & Jackie-O. I've been hovering over all these artists for awhile now and haven't been able convince myself to make a web order for Jackie-O and haven't learned or heard enough from the others. I know Sunburned Hand has some limited release on vinyl and what not. If you are (or anyone else for that matter) familiar with any of them do you have recommendations or comments?

Additionally I've never got around to getting a Boredoms cd. I know I know. I really want to road trip out to that show in Philly I think it is with the Boredoms and Lightning Bolt. You have any favourite Boredoms albums? Have you heard any of the recently reissued stuff?

quote:

There is also drone, artists like Double Leopards, Birchville Cat Motel, GHQ, Alistair Galbraith, Vibracathedral Orchestra and others.

I'm interested in Double Leapords and any other good drone as well. Recommendations/discriptions in this area? I know I'm asking a lot. Anyone of knowledge please chime in. Is there a good distributor for the more abrasive stuff?

I've been promoting Eluvium's Talk Amongst The Trees since its release but never receive any feedback. Has anyone heard this album? In the more ambient/Eno side of drone I think this is the pinnacle. Does anyone else enjoy this album? I have been listening to Recorded in Lisbon a lot to and like it well. Anyone else enjoying or hating these albums?

I would recommend Eluvium's 2005 disc to anyone. I think it is an instant converter.

i like eluvium's talk amongst the trees quite a bit. from almost strictly guitar based drone music, i think, off the top of my head, that record and windy and carl's consciousness are the best there is, although i suppose i tend to like more electronic/computer manipulated stuff like wind-up bird's whips (which also uses guitar) or fennesz's endless summer a little more. but eluvium's talk amongst the trees is a fantastic ambient/guitar drone type album for anyone looking to crack that style of music. i wouldn't really put it under noise, but i think ambient/drone is a good starting place for anyone interested in going down towards noisier stuff eventually.

personally, i think another bridge type album from regular 4-5 piece indie rock music into deconstruction, ambient, and hints of noise would be joan of arc's the gap, although i'm pretty sure no one around here would second that...in fact, i can't even recommend it really, but i think it's great.