Big props must go out to Tarantino for the Kill Bill movies. I hadn't seen the first one until last month when I caught both films at one screening. Yes, this may be heresy, but I'd put it above Pulp Fiction as a single, satisfying complete picture. If at all possible, see them together.

I loved Kill Bill, but I don't know about placing it above Pulp...are you an avid fan of 70s samurai flicks?

I'm not sure I'd put it above Pulp Fiction either, if only because it just doesn't seem right to compare the two...Kill Bill is a law unto itself, Pure Cinema as applied to samurai\martial arts\etc films, and comparing it to anything other than more Kill Bill doesn't feel adequate.

Im not really on the bandwagon of Kill Bill being terrible or the other of Kill Bill being great. It was a fun to watch movie, but at the end of the day I thought it was deeply flawed in many ways and lacked the substance of Tarantino's other films.

I do think Pulp Fiction was better. Even though I enjoyed Kill Bill, I found the problem with the movie to be that all the best action was in Vol. 1, but it had little plot. Vol. 2 had lots of plot, but toned down on the action. This film is great as one picture, but loses some of its greatness when it's split up.

yeah I totally agree with Falcon 7. It would have been a lot better had they not split it. If you look at Kill Bill as one movie (which will be easier to do once the inevitable special edition DVD pack comes out) then I'd put it right up there with Pulp Fiction. Maybe not above but right up there nonetheless.

One of my very favorite films but just not as polished as Tarantino's other work is Reservoir Dogs. It and the vastly underrated Jackie Brown would be 3rd and 4th on my QT list respectively.

This is sort of unrelated, but did it annoy anyone that they mentioned The Bride's name in both the New York Times AND Roger Ebert's column. Ebert apologized in a recent Answer Man, but what about the Times? I know it's a minor quibble, but sonce I read BOTH of those reviews it was spoiled for me.

OK, due to responsibilities, I don't often go see movies at the theatre anymore, but I did FINALLY see "Kill Bill, Vol. 2." Yes, the whole thing works even better when thought of as a single entity. But I was wondering, wouldn't it have been better if there was some way to put everything in chronological order? I admit this might be difficult concerning the anime sequence, but one flashback is OK. As someone mentioned earlier, maybe QT will re-edit the movie and add that campy fight seen he cut out but is on the DVD.

I enjoyed just about the whole thing, but no, it's no "Pulp Fiction." It seemed to me that even with four hours, Tarantino left out some seemingly-simple-to-explain things which would have made the movie more poignant (given it more substance.) I'll have to use the spoiler type here: Exactly how did Bill get his daughter? I have my theory, but I think it would only take a minute and some cool QT dialogue or visuals to explain it. It also seems obvious to me that Bill knew the child must have been his, based on the dialogue describing the length of time which passed after the shotgun-through-the hotel-door scene. Even more importantly, why didn't they get into the context of Bill seeming to be a "good" parent. This would have not only done a better-job of echoing the early scene of Vivica Fox and her daughter, but would also bring some more empathy to both characters and explain exactly what their relationship was before the "El Paso Massacre." As it is, they "dance around" what their daughter means, and we don't even know anything AT ALL about their "relationship", except that the Bride knows that Bill had lots of people killed, including THEIR daughter (NOT).

The whole thing just seems like an (admittedly-entertaining) exercise in technique. I don't expect Tarantino to have to top "Pulp Fiction", but maybe he could show that he's matured enough to understand how even five minutes of substance added to a four-hour movie, could double the overall effect. Right now, I'm thinking that the "substance" of this film is found in David Carradine's and Michael Madsen's performances.

OK, remember that I LIKE BOTH THESE FILMS! I just wanted to throw in my 1 1/2 cents. If you haven't seen them, check them out.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: mark f,

Mark, I FINALLY saw vol. 2 this weekend, and I am going to have to agree with you on the daughter thing. I also felt that he should have included some discussion about Bill as a father. It would seem, by the way the daughter acted and behaved, that Bill didn't do a half bad job raising her in the last four years. But The Bride is so consumed with her passion for revenge that she seems to overlook the fact that her daugher has known no other parents the last four years except her father, and it would seem that she loves him. Now, because of the Bride's selfish motives, her daughter will have to live life without the only father she has known. Maybe I'm rambling too much here, but that's how I felt. Also, on a different note, I was dissapointed with the brevity of the fight scenes in Vol. 2. As each fight began, I was getting excited, saying, this is going to rule. And then, almost as quickly as it began, it was over. I'm sure the point was supposed to be that whatever fighter won each fight was so adept in their particular art form that they only needed a minute or two to defeat their attacker. But still, that doesn't change the fact that I still wanted to see the two fighters beat each other into oblivion for a good 10 minutes or so. Ah well, guess I'll just have to stick with the classic Bruce Lee films for that.

i agree that 1 had all the great action and 2 had the plot but i think of it as one movie. It was a great movie, not just one filled with great action and no plot but the way Terantino made it, the way he directs is what made it great.

As someone who thinks that Pulp Fiction is one of the best films of the 90's, I am also someone who has come to believe that Tarantino is a one-hit wonder. Reservoir Dogs - Good, interesting, but not great. Jacki Brown - Good, but not great, and not even interesting.
Then I get to the Kill Bill movies. I found the first film to be excessively violent and in poor taste...and I'm no prude...I think a film like Goodfellas was excellent. The second movie I thought was a little bit better, but in the end, quite tedious and at least 15 minutes too long. I'm not sure what Tarantino's limitations were given to him for movie length, but I have no doubt this could have been ONE three hour to 3hr and 15 minute movie. Now if he wasn't "allowed" to go that long for one movie, OK, it's not his fault. If he was, it shows an extreme lack of discipline on his part. Also, if I'm allowed to ask this here:

(POSSIBLE SPOILERS): Why was such a big deal being made about The Bride's real name? And then suddenly in Volume II towards the middle of the picture, it's said without a beep. Also, when Michael Madsen originally "got" Thurman, why was she still alive? I'm not talking about the injection, but before.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: mark f,

The answer to the question you posed is Budd (Michael Madsen) shot her with rock salt. I wouldn't know about this, but apparently, it hurts like hell and causes you to bleed, but doesn't actually do any organ damage (I'm not a shotgun expert, so if this is BS, it's QT's fault and not mine.)

As far as the Bride's name, I can't really explain that, except that QT must have thought it was good for more than one joke. Did you catch the other names in that roll call before we hear the Bride's name?

P.S. To hide spoilers, go to that painter's pallette icon next to the happy face, and highlight the black color which will make the type you put in the box the same color as the background.

Answer to question about keeping name away
Terantino is just like that, he is weird, he puts in little things here and there just for his own enjoyment.

quote:

Originally posted by mark f:
But I was wondering, wouldn't it have been better if there was some way to put everything in chronological order? I admit this might be difficult concerning the anime sequence, but one flashback is OK. As someone mentioned earlier, maybe QT will re-edit the movie and add that campy fight seen he cut out but is on the DVD.

Hey, it is possible to do it yourself with today's technology. A very nerdy friend of mine did this with "Pulp Fiction". He managed to do a little cutting & creative editing so scenes wouldn't repeat themselves. The final shot was Butch riding off with his lady love on Zed's chopper. It was a very interesting viewing. You know, I never thought of doing this with "Kill Bill". I think I'll put him to work on it tonight!