I just don't understand the point of listing "the 5 greatest rock bands" when you can include folk singers, electronic artists, progressive jazz, and metal bands. That sorta defeats the purpose for me considering the moderators went through such effort to split up these catagories into different forums.

Fillmore, the term 'rock' is used nowadays to talk about just about anything except rap that can conceivably become popular.

If you want to talk about 'Rock' with the more specific, less encompassing definition...then you need to ask for that more specifically.

Because I don't personally make a distinction between rock such as the Beatles and folkish-stuff such as Dylan when I'm listening to music.

Like it or not, the definition of 'rock' as it is used practically has become fuzzy. So, if you want a more specific listing, be more specific in asking for it.

FH,

The point i'm trying to make is that not every artist is so easily catagorized. Take Bob Dylan for instance. I would call his first couple albums folk, but "Highway 61 Revisited" is undoubtedly a rock album (and "Nashville Skyline" is a country album). Is Rage Against The Machine metal, alternative rock, funk, or rap? Since they fuse all of these styles, how do you decide where to put them?

You said in your previous post that in your book Bob Dylan, The Eagles, Elton John, U2,and Metallica don't fit under the Rock catagory, but for some reason The Byrds, Black Sabbath, and the MC5 do. What's your criteria? Because, I can guarantee that if I go into any local record store, they'd all be sitting together in the "Rock" bin.

Maybe the mods think I'm wrong, but my call would be that as long as it features traditional rock instrumentation, it's rock.

A starting point.

1. Led Zeppelin
2. Pink Floyd
3. Jimi Hendrix
4. Rush
5. The Doors

If metal bands qualify, then I put Iron Maiden in the number 2 spot, and adjust all the following accordingly.

Based on a hard to quantify general impression of consistency, daring, ground-breaking, etc.

Also, Musical accomplishments weighed much, much more heavily than lyrics, which critics always gravitate towards because they are easier to write about, but only 10% of the message.

Finally, these are skewed slightly to my tastes.

1. Beatles - Though the Velvets are my personal favorites, there is no denying the Beatles relentless groundbreaking without ever delivering shit. In retrospect, much in common with Radiohead.

2. The Velvet Underground - Best album of all time, Four album stretch of Nico - Loaded rivaled only by Stones of Beggars - Exile and Radiohead Bends - Amnesiac. No group in history has produce four more disparate but equally brilliant albums in a row.

3. Rolling Stones - At this point, no band, not even the Beatles, can rival their sheer catalog of great songs.

4. Radiohead - Though the Sci-Fi Paranoia is starting to wear a bit thin, still the most consistently daring and excellent band of the last 20 years.

5. U2 - Biggest Sounding and Best arena band of all time. Not to mention this first band to ever strive to be an absolute force for good and not look completely uncool. Joshua Tree seems to have slipped some from the minds of many, but it's still the most emotionally moving album of the last 25 years.

Just Missed...

Dylan - Yes, his impact, songwriting, and lyrics are/were phenomenal...but again, we're not judging poets here, we're judging musicians, and from the standpoint of pure musicianship, he's no more daring than Springsteen...which brings me too...

Springsteen - As great as an artist whose never had an original idea in his life can be. Tremendous honesty when not overly bent on ennobling the blue collar.

Hendrix - The Orson Welles of Rock and Roll - in one album, everything takes a quantum leap forward...kept off the list for two reasons...limited output, and fact that by 1969 his songwriting was regressing at a frightening, almost Doors-like pace. Horrible to say, but from a legacy standpoint, died at the right time. Don't think this guy had much left in him as a songwriter.

4. The Clash - Big Impact, too short a career.

5. The Kinks - Most underrated band of all-time, and one of rocks all time great lyricists. Funny Face, Something Else, Village Green all absolute pop masterpieces. Did some nice work in early 60s and early 70s too.

6. The Byrds - Not as much ambition in their sound, but even today, Eight Miles High remains one of the greatest rock recordings of all time.

7. REM - Consistenly excellent in little ways for almost all the way until Bill Berry left. No group produced more front-to-back albums, where you never want to skip a song.

8. The Temptations - Untouched as finest motown band.

9. Captain Beefheart - Rocks greatest super eccentric...Far more talented and interesting than Zappa...

10. Public Enemy...All Rap must pay homage.

And While We're at it...

Most overrated bands of all time...

1. Doors...
Limited musicians led by a prentious clown with the insight and maturity of a twelve-year-old. Sure some of their songs are classics, but so many are so damn bad.

2. Grateful Dead...
The secret on the world's ultimate jam band...they could hardly play. Incredibly dull.

3. Sex Pistols...Rewarded for Cultural impact only, Bullocks is only marginally satisfy music.

4. Led Zepplin...Loved them growing up, impact huge, but their music, like the Doors, has aged horribly, and everthing after Houses pretty much sucked to begin with anyways.

5. The Who...At times f**ing Great, The Who Sing My Generation still an all time Classic, and Next an arena rock staple...but many of the mid 60s albums almost unlistenable today, and their still better than Tommy, possibly the most overrated album of all time.

quote:

8. The Temptations - Untouched as finest motown band

I would take the Four Tops over the Temptations any day of the week.

quote:

Originally posted by keylimetrev:

quote:

8. The Temptations - Untouched as finest motown band

I would take the Four Tops over the Temptations any day of the week.

I'd take Stevie Wonder over either.

This changes monthly for me, but always hovering around the top are
The Beatles
The Rolling Stones
Cream
The Who
Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars.

quote:

I'd take Stevie Wonder over either

Stevie's fun, but I just can't take some of his political stuff like City off of Innervision, or Black Man off of Songs...they just don't make lyrics any cheesier.

And "Message from a Black Man" by the Temptations is poetry?

Hmm..I wouldn't think of Stevie's political lyrics as 'cheesy'.

..Even more back then than now, it was difficult for inner-city African Americans do be employed, so living conditions were terrible, and back then they were still being treated like inferiors.

This understandably had Stevie Wonder pissed off, and subtlety was the farthest thing from his mind.

quote:

Originally posted by Bobthespirit:
Hmm..I wouldn't think of Stevie's political lyrics as 'cheesy'.

..Even more back then than now, it was difficult for inner-city African Americans do be employed, so living conditions were terrible, and back then they were still being treated like inferiors.

This understandably had Stevie Wonder pissed off, and subtlety was the farthest thing from his mind.

Agreed. Stevie was more likely concerned with delivering a message than being Bob Dylan. His stuff is very straightforward and angry, much in the same way Public Enemy's lyrics were in the late 80s. Artists like Stevie Wonder and Marvin Gaye in the 70s with their more political lyrics had a huge impact on black music.

I actually would say Stevie Wonder's albums have held up as poorly as any from Motown. His albums always sound pretty dated to me. The only stuff of his I really like are the early singles, when he was Little Stevie. Now those are great singles.

Maybe we should start up a motown thread, until then I'd put my picks for best Motown artists as:

1. Four Tops
2. Marvin Gaye
3. The Miracles
4. Supremes
5. Temptations

and of course, really #1 should be given to the Funk Brothers.

quote:

Originally posted by ericg75:
I can guarantee that if I go into any local record store, they'd all be sitting together in the "Rock" bin.

Yeah, but so would Britney Spears. I was just trying to go by the forum catagories.

1. The Clash
2. The Specials
3. Violent Femmes
4. Radiohead
5. The Beatles
6. Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars
7. The Roots
8. The Flaming Lips
9. Bob Dylan
10. Fleetwood Mac

Not sure if some of these count in this category.

DYLAN
BEATLES
BOWIE
STONES
VELVET UNDERGROUND

rage against the machine
red hot chili peppers
nirvana
the beatles
jimi hendrix

quote:

Originally posted by Filmore Holmes:
I was just trying to go by the forum catagories.

"Alternative"?

Anyone who doesn't have Pink Floyd in the top 5 is a little off.

1. Beatles - influence
2. Rolling Stones - awesomeness
3. Led Zeppelin - sheer power (culturally and musically)
4. Pink Floyd - innovation and brilliance
5. Hendrix - Crazy crazy crazy

red hot chili peppers can not hold a sparkler to hendrix, or zeppelin, or floyd, etc. Just think about the actual comparison. It's laughable. Nirvana? Get over Kurt Cobane and realize that the pixies are at least 10 slots higher - they came first - they happen to be the same band. The velvet underground rock. A lot. They are very close for # 5, maybe they even are. Radiohead? NO. Floyd. More soul, more rock, more classic. (more acid too) I love the clash but really.