Do you find comedians that joke about tragedy to be just as humorous as those that avoid that and find other things to poke fun at? The reason I ask is the reaction any comedian gets if he/she so much as mentions 9/11. I think it's a lot easier to laugh at, say, Hiroshima when nobody knows anyone that was killed there, doesn't look like anyone there, and really has no cultural link with those that were killed. It's a time long gone, yet it was the quickest killing of that amount of people ever. Not to mention Nagasaki, but the comedians tend to focus on the more historically obvious, considering as how you'd have to have never gone through school to know that Hiroshima got bombed (Incidentally, you'd be surprised how many people don't know what second city was bombed, go ahead, try it).

But I digress, so do any of you get offended when a newer comedian jokes about the Vietnam War, or the Oklahoma bombings, or anything else that has played a large part in your life? Personally, I find it very disrespectful to the dead and those related to joke about anything that causes so much grief, unless used in a way that cuts at those that caused it. Disucss.

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(Incidentally, you'd be surprised how many people don't know what second city was bombed, go ahead, try it).

I got it right...

With regards to comedians, I don't generally care what jokes are about as long as they are funny. I don't get offended often so I can't really discuss material on personal tragedy, but I will say that I think that much of the 9/11 material out there is horrible, not offensive, just not funny.

Really, I don't really think that it matters what the material is on, there are unoffensive ways to talk about offensive subject matter.

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Originally posted by Mike:

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(Incidentally, you'd be surprised how many people don't know what second city was bombed, go ahead, try it).

I got it right...

With regards to comedians, I don't generally care what jokes are about as long as they are funny. I don't get offended often so I can't really discuss material on personal tragedy, but I will say that I think that much of the 9/11 material out there is horrible, not offensive, just not funny.

Do you think it's possible that the only reason you don't enjoy it is because it is such a tender subject? Maybe the only way for comedians to really start making funny comments about 9/11 is time. Of course, experiencing 9/11 makes me not want to laugh at anything to deal with that, but then, ethically, I couldn't laugh at any more Holocaust, slavery, or war jokes, which is almost impossible.

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Originally posted by Tyler:
do any of you get offended when a newer comedian jokes about the Vietnam War, or the Oklahoma bombings, or anything else that has played a large part in your life?

I have to say, tragedy has played a BIG part in my life & whenever I'm telling people what I've been through I usually make it funny to keep people from feeling sorry for me. I actually haven't heard the jokes you refer to, except for the ones on airline security which have been funny, so I don't know how they exactly handle the material. Really, I thought it was too soon for movies about it, but, what do I know?

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Originally posted by Monkey_Boy:

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Originally posted by Tyler:
do any of you get offended when a newer comedian jokes about the Vietnam War, or the Oklahoma bombings, or anything else that has played a large part in your life?

I have to say, tragedy has played a BIG part in my life & whenever I'm telling people what I've been through I usually make it funny to keep people from feeling sorry for me. I actually haven't heard the jokes you refer to, except for the ones on airline security which have been funny, so I don't know how they exactly handle the material. Really, I thought it was too soon for movies about it, but, what do I know?

I reread your post several times and I still have yet to see your point. My focus was whether or not comedians should use tragedy in stand up, but you haven't made a comment regarding any of that. I noticed you've posted 366 times in 2 months, do you even have time to read what people are saying before you respond?

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Originally posted by Tyler:
My focus was whether or not comedians should use tragedy in stand up, but you haven't made a comment regarding any of that.

Sorry, looks like this is the second time I had ya scratchin' your noodle (the first bein' in the "300" thread in the Best of '07 category)! I guess I didn't make myself clear. (The wife was tuggin' at my arm to get me out of the house!)

I was just saying that it CAN be alright to joke about tragic situations, it just depends on how the material is handled. I've heard Vietnam jokes for decades & they don't seem particularly offensive because they are usually told from a personal point of view, & even then, it has nothing to do with all of the death & horror of what happened over there. I haven't EVER heard jokes on the Oklahoma bombings or 9-11 (except post 9-11 airport security jokes), so I can't comment on them. However, I couldn't imagine them being very tasteful. That's what I meant when I said, "Really, I thought it was too soon for movies about it..." It seems like 9-11 happened just last year to me. I'm sure it feels much sooner to the families of those that died.

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Originally posted by Tyler:
Do you find comedians that joke about tragedy to be just as humorous as those that avoid that and find other things to poke fun at? The reason I ask is the reaction any comedian gets if he/she so much as mentions 9/11.

See, for example, the scene in The Aristocrats where Gilbert Gottfried makes a 9/11 joke not long after the event, and gets hell from the audience. This forces him to tell the Aristocrats joke, which sets the movie up.

Even more telling these days is that you can be called a 'traitor' or 'anti-American' or 'treasonous' by some folks if you tell jokes critical of the President or the administration.

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Originally posted by Monkey_Boy:

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Originally posted by Tyler:
My focus was whether or not comedians should use tragedy in stand up, but you haven't made a comment regarding any of that.

Sorry, looks like this is the second time I had ya scratchin' your noodle (the first bein' in the "300" thread in the Best of '07 category)! I guess I didn't make myself clear. (The wife was tuggin' at my arm to get me out of the house!)

I was just saying that it CAN be alright to joke about tragic situations, it just depends on how the material is handled. I've heard Vietnam jokes for decades & they don't seem particularly offensive because they are usually told from a personal point of view, & even then, it has nothing to do with all of the death & horror of what happened over there. I haven't EVER heard jokes on the Oklahoma bombings or 9-11 (except post 9-11 airport security jokes), so I can't comment on them. However, I couldn't imagine them being very tasteful. That's what I meant when I said, "Really, I thought it was too soon for movies about it..." It seems like 9-11 happened just last year to me. [B}I'm sure it feels much sooner to the families of those that died.[/B]

I agree completely, which is why I ask the question: how is it that comedians have become the arbiter for when the grief suffered by those involved in the tragedy has ceased? It's all relative to those involved and their level of it. Now, I'm sure people will tell me to not get so bent out of shape about it, but I just feel that there should be some unwritten laws that comedians should generally follow.

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Even more telling these days is that you can be called a 'traitor' or 'anti-American' or 'treasonous' by some folks if you tell jokes critical of the President or the administration.

Yes, but that's totally different. That's being critical of someone who you think has done wrong and should be made the butt of a joke, possibly in order to help other people rethink their views on said person. But if you're saying something like "Oh, I missed my connection at the Empire State Building," that's not only being heavy handed, but what is the joke supposed to prove? Jokes should be made to shine light on a problem either through exaggeration or contrast, not just by restating a known fact but substituting in different names or places. Like, "Oh, I was riding this wave in Manila, but I ended up 30 miles inland. Shame about them dead people."

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Originally posted by Tyler:
I agree completely, which is why I ask the question: how is it that comedians have become the arbiter for when the grief suffered by those involved in the tragedy has ceased? It's all relative to those involved and their level of it. Now, I'm sure people will tell me to not get so bent out of shape about it, but I just feel that there should be some unwritten laws that comedians should generally follow.

There are unwritten laws. It's called Human Decency & Compassion, the problem these days is most comedians believe these aren't things they should have in order to be funny.

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Originally posted by Monkey_Boy:
There are unwritten laws. It's called Human Decency & Compassion, the problem these days is most comedians believe these aren't things they should have in order to be funny.

They are 'unwritten' because they do not exist Monkey Boy. Jokes shouldn't have to be self-censored, then we would run into a slippery slope of censorship. Most of the jokes I make in everyday life can be considered offensive, but that is only with people who do not know me and understand the context of my jokes.

Any joke is permissible in the right circumstances.

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Originally posted by Mike:

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Originally posted by Monkey_Boy:
There are unwritten laws. It's called Human Decency & Compassion, the problem these days is most comedians believe these aren't things they should have in order to be funny.

They are 'unwritten' because they do not exist Monkey Boy. Jokes shouldn't have to be self-censored, then we would run into a slippery slope of censorship. Most of the jokes I make in everyday life can be considered offensive, but that is only with people who do not know me and understand the context of my jokes.

A slippery slope if it gets out of hand, but don't you wish that people could ever just stop short of crossing that line over and over again?

Personal boundaries on morality are meant to be crossed, by doing so you can make things that would generally be offensive, acceptable to say, therefore taking the power away from the words.

You have to understand when I make blatantly offensive jokes, they generally point out the ignorance of racism or homophobia. Being in the 'Deep South' of Florida, I see a lot of people (including a few unfortunate family members, one of my grandfather is proud of a dalmation named Buddy, that he claims is "Racist.") with immoral social outlooks, my jokes are aimed at them.

Well, yes, I understand that you're doing the most provocative to elicit a response from the people you're aiming it at. But...we're once again getting away from my point. Dammit, whatever. I'm gonna have a smoke.

Rest in Peace, Richard Jeni.